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Author Topic: insane difficulty agianst torpedos  (Read 833 times)

SkyCore

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insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« on: February 19, 2018, 10:06:49 AM »
iv been testing out the beta on insane mode and i must say that without a doubt torpedoes used against you in the early game is straight up broken. one shot long before you have a chance to build your ship defenses.

on the last game i tried, i warped like 8 times at max distance away from the center to hopefully find a safer place to mine and build my ship up... nope. still one shot on my way further out.

even tried to make my ship over 1/2 engine in hopes of out running them. still not good enough, just didnt have enough starting cash to make the ship fast enough. btw, what is the speed of torpedoes?



Kelevra

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2018, 11:28:19 AM »
What I tried was to maneuver them out, and it worked even with a large ship!
If you just try to run away they will always get you right in the back.. But try out the "rabbit", flying cross to the direction of them will make you dodge the torps and make them run out of flight time ;)

(anyways they make too much damage early on :D)

Ravien

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2018, 09:00:59 PM »
Were these persecutor pirates that spawned on you giving you a message to the effect of "Ah HAH! We found your weak little ship! Prepare to die, weakling!"? If so, that means you were still too close to the core. I found that with an extremely weak ship, if I go into territory that has more titanium asteroids than iron asteroids, I've gone too far.

Anyway, yes, dodge them to give you a chance to jump out, or equip your ship with like 4 PDCs and they should be able to take out most torpedoes, giving you a chance to jump out.

Insane difficulty is, sadly, not quite tuned for the early game. It gives a flat modifier to enemy ships everywhere in the galaxy, instead of tuning early game ships to be easier while late game ships to be harder. This is probably a problem with overall difficulty in general and not specific to torpedoes. Try to take on a pirate 1v1 head on and you'll get destroyed even without them using torpedoes.

SilverKnightGG

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2018, 10:29:46 AM »
My experience has been that I took one torpedo hit intentionally as an experiment and lost about 30% of my hull in that hit, so I decided to run copious amounts of point defense, and since then torpedos are basically just a joke.  I think the damage curve and torpedo health (or their ability to evade PD) needs adjusted a bit for them to continue being relevant.  They are a wasted slot on enemy ships in my SP beta game right now, because I wont ever be hit...  By late naonite, I had afk'd for entire fights against multiple torpedo ships with only 100k shields and 50k hull, which is rather easy to achieve without grinding much at all...  Sure the torpedos' damage scales, but I think that stacking point defense is just a little bit OP against too many things.  Perhaps they need to make point defense weapons unable to target regular ships and stuff so that there's more of a trade-off for using them.

Ravien

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2018, 11:10:36 AM »
My experience has been that I took one torpedo hit intentionally as an experiment and lost about 30% of my hull in that hit, so I decided to run copious amounts of point defense, and since then torpedos are basically just a joke.  I think the damage curve and torpedo health (or their ability to evade PD) needs adjusted a bit for them to continue being relevant.  They are a wasted slot on enemy ships in my SP beta game right now, because I wont ever be hit...  By late naonite, I had afk'd for entire fights against multiple torpedo ships with only 100k shields and 50k hull, which is rather easy to achieve without grinding much at all...  Sure the torpedos' damage scales, but I think that stacking point defense is just a little bit OP against too many things.  Perhaps they need to make point defense weapons unable to target regular ships and stuff so that there's more of a trade-off for using them.

In late game I don't think their damage would scale as well, so you do sacrifice raw damage to use them most likely.

SkyCore

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2018, 11:39:32 AM »
My experience has been that I took one torpedo hit intentionally as an experiment and lost about 30% of my hull in that hit, so I decided to run copious amounts of point defense, and since then torpedos are basically just a joke. 
By early game in my original message, i meant just leaving the starting sector. Tough to use point defense with 0 credits, a few thousand iron, and no components or weapons other than the starting pair of chainguns and mining lasers.

Perhaps point defense should be the default weapon.

dopp

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2018, 01:59:58 PM »
I wanted to see if I could replace regular chainguns completely with PD versions, so I went to a decent level 32 turret factory to check. The PD chaingun on offer was a one-slot turret with 9.5km range and +115% bonus damage for 350 DPS. The equivalent regular chaingun was a three-slot turret with 4.5km range and +45% bonus damage for 3500 DPS (1750 DPS with independent targeting). So the PD chaingun does seem to do much less damage than the regular version.

Ravien

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2018, 01:38:59 AM »
My experience has been that I took one torpedo hit intentionally as an experiment and lost about 30% of my hull in that hit, so I decided to run copious amounts of point defense, and since then torpedos are basically just a joke. 
By early game in my original message, i meant just leaving the starting sector. Tough to use point defense with 0 credits, a few thousand iron, and no components or weapons other than the starting pair of chainguns and mining lasers.

Perhaps point defense should be the default weapon.


You should not be facing torpedo enemies near the starting sector. You can easily mine and find enough materials and credits to purchase some point defense. They only cost about  20k each.

Axen Marik

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2018, 03:54:45 PM »
Running a private server for a group of 5 players on insane and we've noticed a few things about early game torpedoes.

Torpedoes are not available at the equipment dock within any of the starting area zones, despite there being iron and titanium launchers, we have not found any to buy moving coreward until hitting systems with naonite. However, if you are fortunate to hit deep scan sites in the early areas, you will run into pirates and hateful factions that instant shoot them upon you as soon as you jump in system.

Note, this isn't a problem for me, being insane difficulty it feels just about right, with the exception that the available supply of PDC's and torpedoes at equipment docks early game ought to be a bit higher to account for a bit of a learning curve to those just starting to experience the glory of a torpedo turning their hard built iron bricks into a debris field.

Our solution to the early torpedo shortage was to stick to sectors with gates and using local npc ships as meatshields and some boom and zoom tactics to whittle down larger pirate/alien fleets and salvage any wreckage we could get our hands on.

Moving forward I know there are plans to allow for torpedo loot, but I wonder if also we'll get the opportunity to manufacture them at the fighter factory?

Kamo

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2018, 11:50:22 PM »
Quote from: Ravien
You should not be facing torpedo enemies near the starting sector. You can easily mine and find enough materials and credits to purchase some point defense. They only cost about  20k each.
Hmm, there shouldn't be any persecutors before a distance of 425 from the core, but I've seen regular pirate torpedo boats even in the farthest Iron Wastes.
TL 1 torpedoes hit for roughly 400-500 damage, and Iron torpedo launchers have 5 torpedoes each and NPC torpedo boats have only one of them, and the most torpedo boats I've seen in a pirate sector is 3, so having a cruiser-sized ship with health in the ten-thousands may make you survive with quarter-health in the Wastes even without point defense, and then, point defense are probably cutting that necessary HP in half.
However you'll need lots of Iron, as in "send a scavenger and wait for it mine an entire sector in OOTS" amount of Iron, and in Titanium, things are going to barrel higher, with more torpedo damage and 3 more torpedoes per enemy ship...
Insane difficulty has really become insane, and not in a remotely fair way.

Quote from: Axen Marik
Running a private server for a group of 5 players on insane and we've noticed a few things about early game torpedoes.

Torpedoes are not available at the equipment dock within any of the starting area zones [...]
Really weird, I heard about people complaining about the same thing, but I remade my arena's four equipment docks and made another before just to test torpedo stuff, and all five of them now sell torpedoes, on the first try. Maybe the server's galaxy was made before the torpedo updates ?
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Ravien

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Re: insane difficulty agianst torpedos
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2018, 09:25:19 AM »
Quote
Insane difficulty has really become insane, and not in a remotely fair way.

Well, it is called insane. :D